Random Rhetorical Hypebeast Fashion Thoughts

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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby Julio » Mon Jan 11, 2016 12:26 pm

feels relevant to the above discussion:

For most people under twenty in Europe and North America, the lack of alternatives to capitalism is no longer even an issue. Capitalism seamlessly occupies the horizons of the thinkable. Jameson used to report in horror about the ways that capitalism had seeped into the very unconscious; now, the fact that capitalism has colonized the dreaming life of the population is so taken for granted that it is no longer worthy of comment. It would be dangerous and misleading to imagine that the near past was some prelapsarian state rife with political potentials, so it's as well to remember the role that commodification played in the production of culture throughout the twentieth century.


-- Mark Fisher; Capitalist Realism p. 13
(added italics at end of excerpt for emphasis; text doesn't actually engage in such typographical blackmail)
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby TheDutchWonder » Mon Jan 11, 2016 7:31 pm

I don't think that fashion itself is capitalist propaganda or consumerist thinking, but I think the popularization of clothing brands and brand elitism is. It's something I fall into as well, but if I had to choose between two identical shoes, but one was made by John Madden and one by Red Wing, there wouldn't be a second of hesitation. I can say it's because of superior quality, but imagine that somehow I had guarantee that they were the exact same quality. Even then, I would choose Red Wing because I have been pushed to believe that their name and label is more elite and admirable. Fashion has been around since the first loincloth was made, but the idea that buying the best or most expensive version of something will make you happier or better arose along with consumerism.
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby beach » Mon Jan 11, 2016 10:26 pm

If all models are at least 5'9" and seem to be wearing sufficiently long pants in magazines/webstores/shows, why is it so hard to find long women's pants?

edit: ok, I mean I technically know why, but what is with this phenom? is every single pants pic heavily photoshopped? are there special model pants for every sort of pants? are all models always sagging, with the crotch 'shopped? where can i buy special model pants (but for people fatter than models)??

@teck ...example of what?
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Last edited by beach on Thu Jan 14, 2016 7:04 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby ramseames » Mon Jan 11, 2016 10:45 pm

TheDutchWonder wrote:if I had to choose between two identical shoes, but one was made by John Madden and one by Red Wing, there wouldn't be a second of hesitation.


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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby Julio » Tue Jan 12, 2016 7:14 am

TheDutchWonder wrote:I don't think that fashion itself is capitalist propaganda or consumerist thinking, but I think the popularization of clothing brands and brand elitism is. It's something I fall into as well, but if I had to choose between two identical shoes, but one was made by John Madden and one by Red Wing, there wouldn't be a second of hesitation. I can say it's because of superior quality, but imagine that somehow I had guarantee that they were the exact same quality. Even then, I would choose Red Wing because I have been pushed to believe that their name and label is more elite and admirable. Fashion has been around since the first loincloth was made, but the idea that buying the best or most expensive version of something will make you happier or better arose along with consumerism.


that raises questions of articles of clothing as signs/signifiers, though (dangerous and complicated territory that might be over my head). perhaps relevant (to continue this whole marxist critique) is the idea of commodity fetishism which pops up in the first volume of Capital, i believe.

the purdue modules on marx have some relevant info; fragment below for convenience
People in a capitalist society thus begin to treat commodities as if value inhered in the objects themselves, rather than in the amount of real labor expended to produce the object. As Marx explains, "The mysterious character of the commodity-form consists therefore simply in the fact that the commodity reflects the social characteristics of men's own labour as objective characteristics of the products of labour themselves, as the socio-natural properties of these things" (164-65). What is, in fact, a social relation between people (between capitalists and exploited laborers) instead assumes "the fantastic form of a relation between things" (165).


marx's passages aren't as nice to read as fisher's, but he's effectively ground zero.
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby evilfriends » Wed Jan 13, 2016 6:40 am

Would anyone be willing to proxy a Supreme t-shirt from Grailed for me? The seller is based in the US and doesn't want to ship to Germany.

I would of course cover all costs for the product and international shipping. Please PM me if you can help me out (smiling)
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby gustavobradley » Wed Jan 13, 2016 3:22 pm

Julio wrote: that raises questions of articles of clothing as signs/signifiers, though (dangerous and complicated territory that might be over my head). perhaps relevant (to continue this whole marxist critique) is the idea of commodity fetishism which pops up in the first volume of Capital, i believe.

the purdue modules on marx have some relevant info; fragment below for convenience
People in a capitalist society thus begin to treat commodities as if value inhered in the objects themselves, rather than in the amount of real labor expended to produce the object. As Marx explains, "The mysterious character of the commodity-form consists therefore simply in the fact that the commodity reflects the social characteristics of men's own labour as objective characteristics of the products of labour themselves, as the socio-natural properties of these things" (164-65). What is, in fact, a social relation between people (between capitalists and exploited laborers) instead assumes "the fantastic form of a relation between things" (165).


marx's passages aren't as nice to read as fisher's, but he's effectively ground zero.



The whole idea of signs and signifiers (imo) relates on the Marxist critique of commodity fetishism, and is definitely applicable to clothes. Basically, clothes - regardless of what they are - carry meaning other than themselves, and convey things that are beyond their functional purpose. So like a white t-shirt with an Obey logo vs. a white t-shirt with a Supreme logo, while functionally being the exact same, are very different signifiers for both the wearer and the viewer, depending on "social convention" - context, belief, etc. The Supreme logo also adds "value" to the object that's more than the Obey one, despite the fact that they would take the same amount of real labour (in Marxist terms) to create. So the Supreme t-shirt as a sign leads in to the idea of commodity fetishism, and it all cycles back and forth
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby teck » Wed Jan 13, 2016 4:08 pm

its been a minute since i read up on a lot of marx but i think that isn't exactly what marx was trying to explain when he said we fetishize things (although this is related and he would probably have a heart attack at Supreme's market practices). marx was saying that we, the workers, are alienated from the labor it takes to produce goods, and thus believe that goods have an intrinsic value that's set by market forces, as if the things produced had real value outside of the labor it took to make them. for marx, labor was paramount. he wasn't so much concerned with fetishizing brands of tee shirts (no such thing existed really in a scope that we would recognize) so much as the fact that t-shirts were perceived to have a value outside of the labor time it took to produce the t-shirts.

i think he would argue that in a precapitalist world, we would value tshirts exactly at the "cost" of how much labor it is, and then use this to begin a truer process of exchange/barter. its a romantic view on preindustrial times but he had a point that.

again he would probably jump all over the supreme example, and it says something that he realized fetishism before we fetished the fetish.
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby trichomatic » Wed Jan 13, 2016 9:19 pm

wearing a ski mask
cons: ppl think youre a criminal
pros: ppl think youre a criminal, face stays warm
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby bels » Thu Jan 14, 2016 11:10 am

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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby BIGBEE » Thu Jan 14, 2016 11:50 am

Get an acronym bag bela
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby bels » Thu Jan 14, 2016 11:58 am

I want a cooler bag I can strap to my bagjack so that I can transport take away food without it making the bag smell like takeaway food (also, would keep it warmer)
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby BIGBEE » Thu Jan 14, 2016 12:25 pm

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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby bels » Thu Jan 14, 2016 1:06 pm

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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby bleeker » Thu Jan 14, 2016 8:33 pm

Looking around at prices and pieces on patagonia's site, found this passage with some surprising numbers in it
Environmental bankruptcy, as with corporate bankruptcy, can happen very slowly, then all of a sudden. This is what we face unless we slow down, then reverse the damage. We’re running short on fresh water, topsoil, fisheries, wetland—all our planet’s natural systems and resources that support business, and life, including our own.

The environmental cost of everything we make is astonishing. Consider the R2® Jacket shown, one of our best sellers.

To make it required 135 liters of water, enough to meet the daily needs (three glasses a day) of 45 people. Its journey from its origin as 60% recycled polyester to our Reno warehouse generated nearly 20 pounds of carbon dioxide, 24 times the weight of the finished product. This jacket left behind, on its way to Reno, two-thirds its weight in waste.

And this is a 60% recycled polyester jacket, knit and sewn to a high standard; it is exceptionally durable, so you won’t have to replace it as often. And when it comes to the end of its useful life we’ll take it back to recycle into a product of equal value. But, as is true of all the things we can make and you can buy, this jacket comes with an environmental cost higher than its price.

There is much to be done and plenty for us all to do. Don’t buy what you don’t need. Think twice before you buy anything.

Ad from which this is from:
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I always kind of worried about/was conscious of fast fashion and sweatshops (like the many people nowadays) but I never seriously considered the impact of the manufacturing process on the environment and especially not the impact of shipping and transporting. Definitely going to try to nocop or thrift stuff for the time being, maybe that'll lead to some satisfaction with my wardrobe and a good environmental feeling inside
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby CheerUpBrokeBoy » Fri Jan 15, 2016 3:21 am

i want a brand that's basically undercover but replace the punk/new wave references with 90s west coast rap

what nate dogg lyrics do you wanna see on a leather jacket
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby cdghomoplus » Fri Jan 15, 2016 3:23 am

CheerUpBrokeBoy wrote:i want a brand that's basically undercover but replace the punk/new wave references with 90s west coast rap

what nate dogg lyrics do you wanna see on a leather jacket

Palm angels is the first in this style tbh, wait 5 years lots of nwa tupac biggie will permeate fashion esp. with the nwa biopic
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby ramseames » Fri Jan 15, 2016 4:02 am

palm angels is literally the expensive version of HUF plantlife socks
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby cdghomoplus » Fri Jan 15, 2016 4:58 am

ramseames wrote:palm angels is literally the expensive version of HUF plantlife socks

yes this. it's all proto-fake hip hop
like how undercover is fake punk
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby bels » Fri Jan 15, 2016 5:47 am

To all interested RE: Muji Scent Diffuser, yes I do. Send me scented oils please.
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby deadkitty » Fri Jan 15, 2016 3:13 pm

new Susan Cianciolo RUN collection

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what incredible quilting!!
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby ramseames » Sat Jan 16, 2016 7:00 pm

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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby eufemism » Mon Jan 18, 2016 2:44 pm

Yoooooo

Astro boy X bape looks fucking awesome
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby stappard_ » Mon Jan 18, 2016 7:03 pm

I only like to buy clothes that have been worn twice

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luckily there's a suspiciously healthy market for clothes that have been worn twice
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby trasparenti » Tue Jan 19, 2016 7:13 am

When it comes to finding sneakers that fit size 11 feet in japan the struggle is real.

First tried some stussy x moonstars

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too small

then some Spalwarts on sale

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No size 44

then some Cons MIJ

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no size bigger than 9.5

same for One Stars

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then went looking for Manhunts

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too dang expensive!!

then Vans Lampins (not the Supleme collab, there are plain colorways made for the Japanese market)

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nothing above size 9

then I tried some Anatomica x Wakouwa deck shoes

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toebox is crazy long and kinda pricey

Then MHL x Cons

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but they're just basically regular Converse (not as nice as 70's or MIJ) and pricey too!

then Diadora n9000s

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but not stoked on them.

Ended up getting a pair of One Stars on sale, turns out they're huge so a 9.5 actually fits alright. Can't really complain, it was a lot of walkin around but it was just so I could waste money on sneakers so at least I got some exercise. Never bought new sneakers in Japan before but it's very similar to buying clothes; over-the-top helpful service. Staff follows you around the store and attempt to preemptively help you if they see you hover in front of any item for more than a few seconds. Employees at clothing stores will hold jackets and sweaters open so you can just slide your arms in and try to tell you everything about anything. It's the exact opposite of window shopping in America. When I tried on the Anatomica shoes the staff took out a Brannock and measured my foot before getting the shoe and tying it on my foot for me. At the MHL store they grabbed a stool so I could sit down. At the store I bought the Converse at they sprayed the sneakers with leather protector and of course, laced them for me. It's a kinda weird feeling of being pampered that I'm not quite used to yet. I feel more at home at the stores where the employees barely acknowledge your existence. Still neat tho
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby djwildchina » Tue Jan 19, 2016 3:30 pm

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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby ASTROCHIMP » Tue Jan 19, 2016 7:59 pm

eufemism wrote:Yoooooo

Astro boy X bape looks fucking neat-o

The bapehead tee is the only one I'm interested in. I've never copped bape new before so I'm not sure the best way to go about it. I'll probably try pondon.
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby donut_milk » Tue Jan 19, 2016 8:20 pm

Vintage Sears catalogs are amazing to peruse through. Definitely recommend looking; here

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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby meatjacket » Thu Jan 21, 2016 3:19 am

p much any button up/down looks better w white buttons. I swap them all the time.

only exception so far is the OL six dot buttons, theyre so pretty
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Re: random fashion thoughts

Postby Vaeltaja » Thu Jan 21, 2016 6:20 pm

I guess hats aren't clothes.

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