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Re: jean classique business

Postby ramdomthought » Mon Oct 21, 2013 10:48 am

anti-fit is the only good fit though
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Re: jean classique business

Postby hmwut » Mon Oct 21, 2013 9:21 pm

ONI 512's came in today.

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really looking forward to breaking these in.
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Last edited by hmwut on Mon Oct 21, 2013 9:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: jean classique business

Postby smiles » Mon Oct 21, 2013 9:26 pm

Ooh those are nice. I like the crinkly denim.
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Re: jean classique business

Postby can- » Wed Oct 30, 2013 10:59 pm

who invented / started raw denim?

I always attributed the modern form of raw denim (the modern form
of denim) to APC. from there things become really apparent (Dior and brands like nudie/acne bringing us to the glut of brands today like n+f//3sixteen)

I wasn't copping jawnz in 06 tho so there's a lot of speculation. in NYC at least, NdG was fast on APC/dior's heels with high quality, Japan made denims. I omit most Japanese brands (except evisu) because I think the western market was exposed first to brands like APC before the repro obsession fetish took hold. in any case they are (mostly) separate demographics.

was helmut lang an early player? I often see a legacy of lang -> APC -> Dior -> (SLP) described but I don't know if helmut Lang was making raw jeans, or selvage jeans or using Japanese fabrics and these three touch points are really what define modern denim to me, along w. a fairly low rise (which of course Lang pioneered)
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Re: jean classique business

Postby starfox64 » Wed Oct 30, 2013 11:55 pm

i first heard about apc in i think 2007 from gq/esquire. i remember specifically going to the store in nyc to get ns when i was living in bk summer of 08. that being said, one of my friends introduced me to nudie in 2006 and thats where i bought my first raws, though i ordered them from switzerland or something because it was cheaper than any american stockists.
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Re: jean classique business

Postby Bobbin.Threadbare » Fri Nov 01, 2013 11:02 am

Helmut was using selvage raw jeans way before any of this, plus he was looking at archival denim for fits and styling. A jacket of his that I had was made in the late 90's and had a Levis Type I style -- though he left out the pleating and generally cleaned it up.

Raw denim has been around since the start, it just wasn't a 'thing'. Different washes have just trended over time and raw denim is finally seeing a come back. This time is the first time it's really a 'trend', as historically it would have just been raw because that's how denim is made. I feel it's a reaction to 90's-00's over washed/worn looking jeans which no longer fit with the modern silhouette/scheme.

The 'raw denim' community, however, is probably a child of horizontal evolution of the repro market in Japan and the scandinavian look/market here in the west.
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Re: jean classique business

Postby bels » Fri Nov 01, 2013 11:05 am

what is horizontal evolution?
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Re: jean classique business

Postby Bobbin.Threadbare » Fri Nov 01, 2013 3:26 pm

I think I first got this through a comic book (but I'm sure I looked it up). Horizontal evolution is when two organisms or groups of organisms who share a common ancestor but are otherwise different (geogrphically, usually), evolve a gene or behaviour at the same time. So for example if a monkey in Africa picks up a tool and a seperate breed develop the same way in India at the same time, this is horizontal evolution.

So, like, totally, like you know, how Japanese brands and, like, Scandy brands both, like started hyping raw denim.
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Re: jean classique business

Postby JCM » Fri Nov 01, 2013 4:48 pm

Bobbin.Threadbare wrote:I think I first got this through a comic book (but I'm sure I looked it up). Horizontal evolution is when two organisms or groups of organisms who share a common ancestor but are otherwise different (geogrphically, usually), evolve a gene or behaviour at the same time. So for example if a monkey in Africa picks up a tool and a seperate breed develop the same way in India at the same time, this is horizontal evolution.

So, like, totally, like you know, how Japanese brands and, like, Scandy brands both, like started hyping raw denim.


I think convergent evolution is another name for it, if I'm not mistaken.
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Re: jean classique business

Postby sknss » Sat Nov 09, 2013 1:41 pm

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APC 1987 (i think there's a typo on the image)

Jean Touitou says to style.com:
That reminded me of som of the things that we did at APC when we started in '87. It was a reaction to the excesses of the '80s. To make a very clean, beautifully cut pair of raw indigo jeans with no label was a reality shock that fashion needed at the time. You can call it street fashion if you will, but for me it was just a necessity. There were others that did this as well. People like Helmut Lang and Margaret Howell.
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Re: jean classique business

Postby ramseames » Sat Dec 07, 2013 9:01 am

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/864140473/second-narrow-perfect-jeans-made-in-japan-water-re/description

MIJ kuroki mills Raws from a brand here in van. 2 points of interest: J shape cut for what is otherwise a "normal" jean (not weird/artisanal) and some sort of hydrophobic coating that's like waxing but without the sheen/feel.

If it wasn't a kickstarter I'd buy a pair but fuck waiting 3+ months to find out if they're worth the $$$.
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Re: jean classique business

Postby can- » Sat Dec 07, 2013 10:52 am

I'm highly skeptical of jeans with any kind of dwr appliqué. the way denim is woven and how it wears guarantees that most weather resistant finishes won't work very well and will degrade quickly
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Re: jean classique business

Postby sknss » Sat Dec 07, 2013 11:05 am

waterproofing jeans sounds like a solution to a problem that doesn't exist
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Re: jean classique business

Postby maj » Mon Dec 09, 2013 7:01 pm

they say fades reflect your lifestyle, now i have a visual indicator that i lay in bed all day

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i only have whiskers/fading on one side.
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Re: jean classique business

Postby bels » Thu Dec 26, 2013 5:06 pm

Can't find UB 204 tapered cut black raws in stock anywhere so I think in going to shelve the idea of wearing and washing black raws all winter until they become soft and grey and ready for summer
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Re: jean classique business

Postby starfox64 » Thu Dec 26, 2013 8:34 pm

whats the price difference between those and acne or apc?
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Re: jean classique business

Postby thug » Thu Dec 26, 2013 8:43 pm

starfox64: Like $100
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Re: jean classique business

Postby bels » Fri Dec 27, 2013 2:31 am

Do acne do black raws?
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Re: jean classique business

Postby starfox64 » Fri Dec 27, 2013 4:27 am

isnt that the whole point of ace/max/hex cash or whatever?
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Re: jean classique business

Postby bels » Fri Dec 27, 2013 4:34 am

Is the cash wash raw? It's not selvedge (know the two aren't necessarily the same thing)
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Re: jean classique business

Postby ramseames » Fri Dec 27, 2013 4:53 am

they're not washed i don't think. they're black weft though so I dunno how they'd fade anyway. not like a super stiff denim though, the spandex makes them pretty comfy right off the bat.
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Re: jean classique business

Postby deadkitty » Fri Dec 27, 2013 5:03 am

cash are overdyed and coated so they wont really fade
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Re: jean classique business

Postby can- » Fri Dec 27, 2013 5:23 am

my max cash didn't come overdyed or coated and they fade a ton (quite pleasantly) every wash
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Re: jean classique business

Postby deadkitty » Fri Dec 27, 2013 6:12 am

maybe it changes from season to season. I remember talking to the dude at Barney's in sf in april and he said they were coated and iirc the acne website said they were overdyed last year.
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Re: jean classique business

Postby starfox64 » Sat Dec 28, 2013 4:31 pm

found my old uniqlo selvage jeans (c. 2008). made in china not japan though. when i bought these they were the tightest pants i had ever owned.

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Re: jean classique business

Postby deadkitty » Tue Jan 07, 2014 6:14 am

just got apc petit new standards in the mail. what a fantastic cut. idk why anyone would even buy petit standards anymore unless they're a girl or something
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Re: jean classique business

Postby starfox64 » Tue Jan 07, 2014 8:30 am

deadkitty wrote:just got apc petit new standards in the mail. what a fantastic cut. idk why anyone would even buy petit standards anymore unless they're a girl or something


i also just bought a pair and i am similarly pleased
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Re: jean classique business

Postby deadkitty » Wed Jan 08, 2014 10:24 pm

Tproc: Image
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Re: jean classique business

Postby bels » Wed Apr 16, 2014 6:59 pm

I think we can all agree the denim fit o meter is very palpably swinging away from slim/skinny fit. Get out that slim straight/regular leg denim, friends. Increase your ideal leg opening by 1/2 an inch at least.

Actually I think there's still space for the 7 inch leg opening but it has to be acheived by a strong taper near the end rather than drainpipe skinniness all the way down.
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Re: jean classique business

Postby RycePooding » Wed Apr 16, 2014 7:28 pm

I remember when I thought my New Standards were way too baggy. Now I'm looking for parachute jeans.
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