Veganarchism

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Re: Veganarchism

Postby Iliam » Mon Feb 16, 2015 8:05 am

@thephfactor
i've had the low vegan docs for 4 years now. they hold up well. the 'leather' looks pretty good/ real, if that's important 2 you.

the creasing and wear on the shoes isn't as 'beautiful' (subjectively defined) as on my very old MIE leather docs. not sure what the leather on the newer docs is like. it could be just as 'un-beautiful' as the vegan 'leather'. i also find that the vegan docs are more sweat-retentive, but that could just be me.

it's worth thinking about why you're buying them. if you're buying the vegan docs for ethical reasons it's (arguably) better to buy second hand docs than buying brand new vegan ones and thereby creating increased demand for shoes that (probably) use environmentally aggressive production processes to create the plastic for the shoes, which will start breaking down in 10^100 years, as well as rewarding doc martens for (probably) exploiting chinese labourers. i.e. if you are buying them as a 'ethical' decision, buying second hand docs from your local second hand store/ ebay seller (whether leather or vegan) is probably 'better'.

i have no idea what 'felix rub off' is.

:geek:
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby Bobbin.Threadbare » Mon Feb 16, 2015 10:39 am

Disagree that buying old leather is better than new alternatives. I used to think this way and thought it was logical.

If you believe wearing another animals skin is not for you, then the age of that skin doesn't make it okay.

Im kind of over the Jarvis that leather alternatives are terrible for the environment. Some are, loads aren't. Inseminating a cow, rearing it on food (sometimes modified), slaughtering it, cutting it to pieces, tanning (largely extremely harmfully) and sewing bits from lots of other cows together to make shoes (high street to runway tier) is destructive.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby UnwashedMolasses » Mon Feb 16, 2015 11:58 am

I don't know much about leather alternatives, but I will say that of all the animals raised for agricultural purposes, cows are absolutely the worst in terms of the overall environmental impact, the amount of energy required in raising them, how they impact the soils, et cetera.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby thephfactor » Mon Feb 16, 2015 12:58 pm

Thanks guys.

@iliam thanks for the info, that's what I was looking for. I am definitely looking to get a 4+ year boot. Was there a report of mistreatment by the company? That would definitely be a concern for me.

@Bobbin.Threadbare I'm not categorically opposed to wearing another animals skin per se, just don't want to contribute to the model that kills them. I mean the reasoning being that if they're already dead, and the money I'm paying for them doesn't go to the company, it doesn't matter much anyhow. However it's a lot more exciting to consider buying a new vegan product, and contributing to a new model altogether rather than just prolong an old one's lifespan. And in the end, I'm making this decision for myself first and foremost, and I guess I am just more comfortable with the idea of wearing something vegan. (smiling)
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby maj » Thu Feb 19, 2015 4:34 pm

the wife recently subscribed to this sort of approach

http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/the-lead ... ess-meat-2
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby Syeknom » Thu Feb 19, 2015 7:19 pm

I was consciously living that life - only really eating chicken and infrequently at that (once a week maybe?), plus a couple of meats that were easier to abstract away like salami or whatever. Lived that way for years and felt pretty comfortable with it - the strictness of a proper exclusionary diet didn't appeal (especially as my relationship to decent foods has always been questionable, and I frankly needed the occasional meat to ensure i was getting any goodness whatsoever). I figured that having a low impact as a consumer was already a Good Thing, and it was/is most certainly! However, in the last couple of months I've made a switch to full vegetarianism and the difference in mindset has driven me to much more actively seek out healthier ways of eating (loads more vegetables/fruits/nuts etc). It's turned out to be an immensely relieving resolution to my antagonism towards meat and I'm free of the background discomfort and guilt I had surrounding the issue. In a personal way becoming more exclusionary has been freeing rather than restrictive.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby sknss » Sun Feb 22, 2015 8:39 am

i'm taking a B12 supplement which makes my wee go neon yellow (a harmless secondary effect). every time i go to the loo i freak out for one second, then i remember i'm not dying.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby sknss » Wed Mar 25, 2015 7:51 am

veganarchists spotted in Paris
(the skeleton says "eat 5 fruit and vegetables a day")
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby bels » Thu Mar 26, 2015 5:10 am

http://www.adolfodominguez.com/uk/vegano/

Adolfo Domiguez Vegan ladies collection.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby sknss » Fri Apr 03, 2015 11:19 am

the people's potato cookbook

this cookbook is amazing!!

just look at their description
The focus of the cookbook is to provide accessible and inexpensive vegan recipes while situating this manner of eating within an anti-capitalist social and ecological context.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby sknss » Sat Apr 11, 2015 9:57 am

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Re: Veganarchism

Postby maj » Sat Apr 11, 2015 11:57 am

if ur honest with urself, they look better than what most mainstream footwear giants put out

https://etnies.com/shop/vegan/
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby bels » Sat Apr 11, 2015 12:18 pm

are you sure
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby maj » Sat Apr 11, 2015 12:29 pm

these are the true test bela, it's one thing thiking ur better as u hunt obscure brands on ebay and buy vintage. but are u actually willing to buy etnies shoes?

or are you....

a poser????!!!!
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby bels » Sat Apr 11, 2015 12:40 pm

Dries Van Syeknom sent models wearing Etnies down the runway in his aw 2002 collection "Le Metro Et Les Neiges"

They wore transparent plastic backpacks which had square toed shoes in them. Was an article about it in the Guardian talking about the rise of commutercore a couple weeks afterwards but it was readily forgotten.

Would rather just coppen some vans tho

http://vegankicks.com/2014/07/vegan-van ... july-2014/

Vans Classic Authentic Black
New Vans vegan list! Well, there’s not a whole lot new here. It is pretty much the same as the last time we did this, but we thought we would give an update in case anyone was wondering, or for people new to the site. As in the past, Vans has a decent selection of vegan shoes, but is still entirely arbitrary and confusing. Why aren’t all the canvas models animal free?

Here’s the List:

Classic Authentic (Canvas Only)
Classic Era (Canvas Only)
Classic Slip-on (Canvas Only)
Classic Zapato Del Barco (Canvas Only)
Zapato Lo Pro (Canvas Only)
Classic 106 Vulc (Canvas Only)
KVD (Canvas Only)

Custom Slip-on, Era & 106 Vulcanized (the Custom Old Skool is NOT vegan)

Old Skool Vegan (only if it states Vegan)
Sk8-Hi (True White colorway Only)
Rowley 99’s – (Black/Synthetic Only) – Limited Edition

Also, they may have additional styles available that would be Vegan-Friendly. If you’re interested in a specific style not listed here, feel free to contact them at vanscustserv@vfc.com. They are pretty responsive.


You can get through 90% of life with the above shoes.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby maj » Sat Apr 11, 2015 12:42 pm

i was under the impression vans were not vegan? bobbin was talking about glues and such which excluded them

probing the site

Finding a vegan shoe is often a challenge because of the glue. It’s straightforward enough identifying shoes that are made out of leather or wool. If the eye test doesn’t work, most websites will state whether it’s real leather or not. But even when you ask, many companies don’t know what the glues are made from.

So we reached out to the authorities at PETA with some questions, and we got some answers. Here’s what they told us about glue used in shoes:

Animal proteins like casein from milk or collagen from flesh, bones, skins, tendons, ligaments, and other body parts are used to make animal-based glues. To extract collagen from tissue, animal parts are cleaned, softened, and boiled in water to create a stock. The stock is concentrated and impurities are removed. Essentially the same process has been used for thousands of years to make glue.

The use of animal ingredients in industrial glues is increasingly uncommon since a large variety of synthetic adhesives now exist, each with different applications. These adhesives are often chosen over animal based glues because they can be produced at a constant rate and to meet specific manufacturing standards. Synthetic adhesives can be customized to perform well for a business’s specific application and manufacturers may be hesitant to reveal trade secrets about what exactly is in their adhesives.

We encourage you to contact shoe companies directly about the type of adhesives they use. In doing so, you will be showing these companies that there is a demand for more animal-friendly materials and, ultimately, helping to change the industry. You might also consider writing to vegan shoe companies to find out what specific synthetic glues are being used and why they were selected. Companies expect to hear from organizations like PETA, but when they hear from their customers, it sends an even stronger message—that cruelty to animals is bad for business and won’t be tolerated.

We hope this information is helpful, and can clear up some of the confusion over this issue. It is hopeful to hear that synthetic glue is overtaking “traditional” glue in application. But it makes you wonder why factories are still using animal glues at all. If you have any questions, please feel free to reach out to us (or PETA). Thanks!
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby bels » Sat Apr 11, 2015 12:48 pm

Dunno. Suspect @katy katazome might know as she wears slip ons.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby Bobbin.Threadbare » Sat Apr 11, 2015 1:52 pm

Lots of glues aren't vegan but I've read, from the brand directly, that all canvas vans are totally vegan.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby sidewalk » Sat Apr 11, 2015 4:07 pm

polio
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby Bobbin.Threadbare » Sat Apr 11, 2015 4:25 pm

I think people need to make their own peace with their food choices. Without beating around the bush I now feel that a well treated slave may be a kinder way to keep slaves - but it doesn't make it okay.

I feel like it's clear that half measures are easily forgotten. People are weak willed.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby sidewalk » Sat Apr 11, 2015 4:36 pm

polio
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby Bobbin.Threadbare » Sat Apr 11, 2015 5:08 pm

Being at peace with something is hopefully the opposite of ignorance. If you care at all you'll educate yourself and make a choice - that's what being at peace with a decision is. Lots of people know everything I know about the meat industry and keep on shovelling flesh down their throats. Blissful ignorance is separate entirely.

I would obviously prefer people were ethical - in line with MY ethics but I think it will take time. I really truly believe humankind in the future will look back on how we treated and ate animals the same way we look back at slavery.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby sidewalk » Sat Apr 11, 2015 6:04 pm

polio
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby Bobbin.Threadbare » Sat Apr 11, 2015 6:11 pm

There's a lot wrong with the world. Saying "yeah but x still happens so let's address that" is a cop out. Everyone can make small decisions and make the world better. I mean, for fucks sake, not wearing and eating animals doesn't diminish your quality of life. I feel like it makes it better - with the added benefit of nothing dying for you.

I don't know what can be done. People could stop philosophising and stop supporting suffering when they next decide they need shoes for one thing.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby sidewalk » Sat Apr 11, 2015 11:17 pm

Stop philosophizing? I don't understand what you mean.

As an aside, I appreciate you sharing your thoughts with me even though I've been disingenuous and rude in the past. I've missed lots of opportunities to learn from others out of disdain.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby sknss » Sun Apr 12, 2015 7:40 am

sidewalk wrote:So in a sense I'm not asking what "I" can do, I am asking "what" can be done (not in an attempt to discredit anyone or say you are wasting your time, I am just interested in your opinion as you know a lot more than me about this)?


i guess politicians could start getting involved. another aspect of veganism is the environmental side.it's not just a personal choice. people's eating habits will have to change in the future anyway because eating so much meat is simply unsustainable. for example producing one burger requires the same amount of water as taking a shower daily for two months. just look at the draught happening in california right now. this is becoming a major issue.

i highly recommend the film Cowspiracy that tackles this issue

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Re: Veganarchism

Postby radicalbusiness » Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:18 pm

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Figured you all may appreciate this. Got to meet probably the most influential food writer of all time last week when he came to my university. He did a roundtable discussion where he addressed questions students had for an hour. I managed to sneak in easily enough since they never actually checked the guest list. While I have a lot of issues with his writings (mostly his failure to address the intersection of economic/class limitations and food choices) it was still really rad to meet him and hear him talk about the US food system and his writings.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby sknss » Sun Apr 26, 2015 5:22 am

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Re: Veganarchism

Postby maj » Sun Apr 26, 2015 6:03 am

My uncle owns a home in the avocado capital of the world, he was telling me they have avocado police to stop avocado theft.
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Re: Veganarchism

Postby bels » Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:50 am

Are you an avocando or an avocantdo
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